In this season 1 finale episode, released on August 3, 2021, podcast host R Blank, co-host Stephanie Warner and producer James Burtt discuss their highlights from the season. As you might expect, despite both being experts in the sector, both R and Stephanie have gained an even deeper level of understanding on certain aspects of EMF issues, whilst Producer James shares that he has had his eye well and truly opened to the impact of electromagnetic health issues.
The Healthier Tech Podcast is the show bringing you a practical solutions-based approach to understanding how best to live in balance with our increasing reliance on tech.
The show from Shield Your Body brings you expert voices that clearly explain the science that matters to you, and the usable tips that you can use to live healthier, while defending against the health risks of modern day technologies.
In this episode, R Blank, CEO of SYB and host of Season 1 of The Healthier Tech Podcast, is joined by his Operations Director Stephanie Warner to discuss their main takeaways, lessons and learning from the series featuring some of the most impactful voices and thought-leaders in the EMF, electro sensitivity and general wellbeing space. They are also joined by the season’s producer James Burtt who shares his “layman’s terms” insights of what he – as an outsider to the EMF sector – has been educated on during the show.
In this summary episode the trio discuss their highlights from the season including:
- How to Stop Technology Addiction with Adam Cox
- Architecture & Building Biology with Stephen Collette
- Electro Sensitivity and WiFi Allergies with Lloyd Burrell
- Building EMF Resilience with Nutrition with Cathy Cooke
- Combating the Negative Health Effects of Tech Addiction with Gary Brecka
- How Technology Is(n’t) Regulated with Dr. Devra Davis
As you might expect, despite both being experts in the sector, both R and Stephanie have gained an even deeper level of understanding on certain aspects of EMF issues, whilst Producer James shares that he has had his eye well and truly opened to the impact of electromagnetic health issues which has resulted in him making lifestyle shifts to accommodate accordingly.
For more information on the subject covered today head to https://www.shieldyourbody.com/ for resources, in-depth articles, free tips and PDF guides to learn all about EMF, health and protection.
Also make sure you hit SUBSCRIBE on this podcast so that you are notified when the next series goes live.
R Blank 0:00
Hello everyone, I’m R Blank and welcome back to the season one finale of the healthier tech podcast, the podcast about a healthier approach to living alongside modern technology. Before we begin a brief word, this podcast is brought to you by my company shield your body, where it is our mission to help make technology safer for you and your loved ones to enjoy. Inspired by the life’s work of my father, Dr. Martin Blanc, one of the world’s leading EMF scientists, I founded shield your body in 2012. And we provide a ton of great and free resources for you to learn all about EMF radiation, like articles, ebooks, webinars, videos, and this podcast. And we also have a world class catalog of Laboratory Tested EMF and 5g protection products from our phone pouch and laptop pad all the way up to our bed canopy. All of our shielding products are Laboratory Tested and include a lifetime warranty. Learn more about our products, while we have hundreds of 1000s of satisfied customers around the world at shield your body.com that shield your body all one word.com and use promo code pod to save 15% on your first order, and free shipping throughout North America and Europe. Today we’re going to take a look at some of what we learned this season. And to help us do that we’re bringing in our producer James from London. Hi, James. Hello, thank you for letting me be on your podcast. Oh, it’s my pleasure. Thank you so much for for being willing to participate. Now
James Burtt 1:20
my pleasure I have I’ve enjoyed this season immensely. I have been a mixture of terrified by the content and educated by in equal measure, but I’m sure we touched on episode but yeah, it’s been fascinating to listen, as I always say that I’m sort of like this The Idiot’s Guide. And Stephanie is always very polite says, No, you’re just new to it. I’m like, okay, you’re polite, but he knows really, I’m going to be interested to share what my insights have been to get your take on it as the experts in the field.
R Blank 1:44
Yeah, no, and I’m really glad that you’re joining us. Because, you know, Stephanie and I are in the trenches kind of every day on these issues. And so we really appreciate having someone with more of an outsider perspective to come come in and sort of share, you know, what you got out of the season?
Stephanie Warner 2:01
Yeah, and and also like, you know, if you don’t mind sharing, or wherever you feel comfortable sharing how it may have you know, this, this new knowledge may have affected how you approach your relationship with tech?
James Burtt 2:15
Yeah, absolutely. Because it really has every I know, I’m not I’m not paying the podcast lip service by saying that in any way, shape, or form. You know, some of the some of the episodes that we’ve recorded have made me really look at the behavior of myself and my family and how we operate in our house. And there’s definitely been some some shifts have been made for sure. So I’m looking forward to sharing that on this on this episode.
R Blank 2:36
Thank you, that’s actually probably one of the best compliments you you could have given because that’s the goal. That’s the goal of the podcast is to help people learn the controls that they have, and the impacts of the decisions that they make in, in their relationships with technology. So let’s let’s step back to our first interview, it was with Adam Cox, the hypnotherapist who was who was talking about technology addiction and ways to stop it. Do you do you remember that that interview James?
James Burtt 3:06
Yeah, I do. I remember that really well, because I’ve I actually know Adam quite well. And I’ve read some of his work. Previously, I’ve listened to a lot of his podcasts, I actually, I helped him to launch some of his podcast, actually. And, you know, as a hypnotherapist, he’s very, very well respected here in the United Kingdom. What I what I found most interesting about that was how, because obviously, we were talking, or when we started out the sort of the remit of this podcast, I thought we’re gonna be talking about like the the hardware of tech, if that makes sense. But actually the psychological way that technology is used, almost, I hate to say it, but used against us to keep these devices in our hand was really, really interesting, because, you know, it’s the issue with technology. And EMF in general, is only relevant if these things are near our bodies. And the way to keep near our bodies is by addicting us to what’s on the screen. So yeah, I thought it was a really interesting insight from Adam.
R Blank 3:57
Yeah, that’s a great point that these, these devices, these, well, these experiences, really, they’re engineered for addiction, because that’s what keeps us coming back and using them. And obviously, you know, we come at it with from a perspective of what that means in terms of emf exposure. But I think Adam really illuminated you know, what that means, just in terms of overall quality of life, how this can impact so many aspects of your life and that this these devices are engineered to be addictive. It’s kind of crazy when you when you put it in those terms.
Stephanie Warner 4:31
Yeah, you know what, what I thought was interesting is it is how I look at Little things like Netflix even now, where you know, there was part of the discussion, you know, talking about how Netflix now took away the end credits because it takes you out of the flow. It distracts you from the pattern of watching continually, and you know, I understand why they do it. I get the business goals. But you know, there is a cost to that. And I hadn’t really, really thought about it in that at that level until that interview.
James Burtt 5:08
Yeah, absolutely. And one of the things that I think were common which episode it was, it was mentioned in, but you know, Netflix is number one competition I think I’ll set you up with so tripped you up intentionally. One of the intros or one of the outro to the show said, you know, who’s Netflix’s number one competition back in the day, and you said, are blockbuster. And
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I think that actually shows you the psychology with which these platforms are going into it. It’s almost this beautifully. I hate to say it again, beautifully, like evil symbiotic relationship between tech companies who are making the hardware and the people who are making this stuff that keeps us on these devices, because you know, the, the more eyeballs and the more time that people can get you on stuff. The the better is a weird one. Is it with things like Netflix? because realistically, you think that there isn’t actually there isn’t really a sort of a monetization model to them keeping you stuck in your chair? Because you know, they’re not running out, but you’re already paying for the service, right? Why would they sort of like reverse engineering and give you, you know, the whole season of bridgerton, or whatever that one’s called? Is this is a subject for another podcast. But what I’d like to go through all in one go, you would think they want you to sort of eke it out as the content but they they don’t they just want you to be, I guess what they’re really trying to do is make their platform part of your habitual behavior. And they have changed habitual behaviors with things like, you know, dumping a whole season or a whole series in one go. So yeah, really interesting. And the thing that I found most insightful with Adams episode was when he was saying, you know, for it to be an addiction, it just means that you don’t want to stop, you can’t stop. And how many times have you got to midnight gone? Do you know what I’ve read? I’ve got an early start, I need to go to bed. Just one more episode that we sort of laugh about at the time. Oh, I’m gonna regret this in the morning. But that is a mild addiction. Like that is an addictive issue. So yes, is where, for me, he’s sort of framed in a way and this has been the sort of highlight of the season for me is that it made you think about it without trying to scare you into changing your behaviors you made you think in a different way.
Stephanie Warner 7:17
Yeah, absolutely. And I, you know, I it’s so irresponsible to make sleep the enemy against, you know, that. We need that, like, it’s it, I would feel like it’s in their best interest if we live long lives. And sleep is how we regenerate. You know, it’s so yeah, it just
R Blank 7:36
seems criminal. James, you’re reminding me last last night, I knew. I knew I had to wake up early today for this recording. And I just finished Episode Seven of Jupiter’s legacy. So there was only there’s only there’s only one more left. I was like, No, I’m not going to watch it. I’m going to bet so I can wake up refreshed for this interview. And the way you just explained, it made me feel like I just had a little victory over Netflix.
James Burtt 8:00
But the other thing I’ve done I thought was really interesting with Adams shows, you know the fact he’s talking about how COVID exacerbated people’s addiction because it was almost like Netflix and those kind of streaming services became like our, our best friends didn’t it? In the absence of actual people. We kind of had this weird. I think we’ve got an even deeper relationship with certain platforms. And I you know, I love Netflix. I think it’s great. You know, I listened to the founders podcast, I’ve bought his books, I buy his stuff, I pay him 10 quid a month for Netflix. I wouldn’t say I’m addicted, but I I don’t know if I could live without him now. So maybe that isn’t addiction. I think my children also I have an addiction to cocoa melon. If you’re a parent, you know that we’re on Netflix. That stuff’s crazy. But yeah, it’s really they have definitely, if the if the intent of these platforms is to change consumer behavior than how they utilize content has definitely ticked that box for sure.
R Blank 8:55
Yeah, like you. I actually, I think this came across in the episode, trying to remember, but when he talked, he started talking about Netflix in the context of tech addiction. I sort of didn’t really want to accept it. You know, that? You know, because I think of tech addiction. I think of all those people who are addicted to you know, Facebook or Instagram
James Burtt 9:14
games, I was thinking of those kids on Xbox are like, Yeah, I don’t want to wouldn’t want to be a parent to one of them. Yeah.
R Blank 9:22
Flipping on Netflix, you know, what’s what’s what are they just released right now? Can I binge it? The whole, in fact, the the term binge watching, I think, came from Netflix. I that wasn’t a concept until Netflix was was streaming content.
James Burtt 9:37
No, no, the whole the whole methodology of content. Sort of absorption was literally created via Netflix. And they, you know, there’s a lot of, you know, the people talk about, you know, Facebook’s evil algorithm and Instagrams evil algorithm, but actually, you know, that this stuff, the data points that Netflix have got on you, in terms of what they show you next to Stephanie’s point A minute ago. You’ll never see the full credits anymore. They’re showing you The next thing that you’re going to you’re going to, you’ve sat there and watched the end of an episode or something, and then, you know, coming up next or suggested for you like, Oh, I think I would like that. Well, yeah, because they got 17,000 data points on you is not an accident. You know, it’s, it’s, yeah, it’s by design that you’ve seen that and further,
R Blank 10:19
further to that point. I mean, they literally they call it binge watching. Like in what context is bingeing considered to be something you’re encouraged to do. Like no one ever says, Oh, I, I binge on vitamin C, and I binged on salad and I binge on exercising. No, they talk about what binge eating on ice cream and you know, bingeing on alcohol. And you know, those are bad things. And now it’s bingeing on on Netflix, and it’s like, oh, yeah, everyone does it.
James Burtt 10:45
Yeah. It’s almost like a bit of a badge of honor. Isn’t it of that season? Yeah. binge watch the whole thing in two nights. It’s weird. I say, no one’s gonna go. Oh, yeah, you know, I just absolutely binge 17 cucumbers. I feel so great. oranges, my vitamin C’s through the roof is always this was a very when you think it’s a very strange badge of honor. Isn’t it? Like, on my TV? I can’t leave it. But great. Hold on you mate.
Stephanie Warner 11:10
Right. But also also, there’s another point here. And it’s how Facebook in social media perpetuates the bingeing mentality. Because what happens if you miss an episode of something when it airs? The next day, you have to avoid Facebook? Because somebody is going to spoil it for you.
James Burtt 11:28
Yeah, absolutely. It’s the same as sports, isn’t it? Yeah. addictive mentalities is very, yeah, it’s like to say it’s like the symbiotic hardware software, social platform content on their card, because you can’t and again, this goes back to the sort of the data point, which is probably you know, the subject for season two, potentially, but the data points but you know, they they know how much of an episode that you’ve watched, if something they know if you’re on your phone at the same time, they can serve you up these adverts, like you say, the whole, the whole thing is about trying to, you know, up the level of consumption to such a high level for and you can’t escape it unless you literally put your phone on airplane mode and you know, or your computer or you know, run out into nature and just sit in the woods.
Stephanie Warner 12:12
What’s interesting too, though, is when you turn your phone off, what do you do oftentimes, it’s go watch TV, it’s go it goes to you know, go it consume another another, you know, piece of technology and experience
R Blank 12:24
on a different device. Well, so that was that was a really like that, that recap and it did force me to come to confront myself on some of my Netflix, my relationship with Netflix, you and me both. So then we got into the next interview with Steven Colette from the building biology and student James I am I correct? You hadn’t actually heard of the building biology Institute until we started planning that episode. Is that right?
James Burtt 12:54
No, I didn’t even know building biology was a thing when you when Yeah, you guys sent through the list of suggested sort of topics and subjects and I was like, I think there’s a typo here. They’re building biology What are these guys on and I looked into there’s so much stuff that is related to the way that we live in again a testament to the to the guests that you guys pulled together for this season, because Steven was at yet another person who beautifully illustrated the challenges that we have but also wasn’t here to like fear monger people but I’ve got to say at the end of it I now fear my carpets I’ve got the thickest pile carpet you’ve ever seen in your entire life and it’s always been like a luxury because whenever my friends come over they come upstairs and I’m like God your carpet is so soft is like like half an inch thick and I’m like yet luxurious carpet we are fancy and this house is going to kill you It’s so soft because of all of those micro particles. I said this to my wife literally on Sunday every time I’d now like Hoover the carpet of vacuum the carpet I relive that episode and I’m like literally I should spend 20 minutes per square foot so unless you want us to have loads of bugs you will allow me to do it in stripes over a random
R Blank 14:09
I’m impressed at the fact that you haven’t you haven’t you’ve been able to prevent yourself from actually just going home and ripping it all out. So
James Burtt 14:17
rental my landlord would kill me Otherwise Otherwise I would absolutely do I try and live downstairs now with his wooden flooring and tiles but other than that, I don’t even want to go to the bedroom anymore. More so to get better money. Nope, you binge Netflix. I’m giving with one hand that I’m taking away with another. Yeah.
R Blank 14:38
I’m guessing that you don’t have pets because I used to like carpeting too. And then I started having pets and when you have pets carpeting is just like the worst. Because you know everything they shed just ends up embedded in in the carpeting. So I try I’ve tried to live without carpeting now for about 20 years but it wasn’t because the building biology it It was just because of pets.
James Burtt 15:01
Yeah, I had no idea that this would be classed as building biology. But it’s even things like eating. And again, one of the I know, one of your sort of, sort of ideas or actionable steps, you wanted people to take away with something, you know, something actionable from the podcast, but not fear mongering. And it really like, you know, like, the level of dust in the house, and all that kind of stuff is really, really made me think about it differently. You know, sort of like leaving the phone outside the bedroom, there’s, there’s definitely some tactical stuff I now, don’t do. Based on this podcast, for sure. Even even things that you know, are the master bedroom in our house is above, wherever the Wi Fi devices are and stuff, we just we’ve got, you know, hue Philips Hue lighting, and we got Wi Fi lights. I mean, it’s our house, our house is a nightmare, we should be running around with shield your buddy blankets on us all the time. used to do when you’re a kid, but he’s really like, We’re looking now at changing all the bulbs out to normal bulbs, we’re looking at change, like turning all the devices off at night. So is really, and this is good, what’s great about it, because a lot of the stuff that I read in preparation of work with you guys, you know, a lot of the advice was, you know, like, basically move out to the countryside live in a yurts as well, that’s not it’s totally feasible. But actually, all of the guests for this season have gone, you know, you can’t get away from it, but just try and do your best with it. And I’ve loved that message.
Stephanie Warner 16:21
Yeah, every every little thing helps every little thing helps. And I think, you know, going back to the, to the carpets, even when he was discussing, that there’s there’s that fear point, but he was also laying out really simple things to do, like open your windows while you vacuum vacuum more often. And if you can invest in, like half a vacuum. So he was you know, kind of it was kind of scary. But also he just was like, hey, and here’s some things you can do.
James Burtt 16:49
Yeah, the other thing that I loved about Stephen is that he had come from it from a place that he was like, not interested in it in any way shape, or form until his his baby got poorly. And that so he came at this from a really good intentioned place, if that makes sense, because he needed to help his family. And the overall feeling that I’ve got from him was that he just wanted to try to help more other families. And this is, you know, the first step towards sort of making a change in anything like this is just having a, even a 1% increase in your awareness that, you know, there’s maybe something you can do about it. So that was great. And you know, how I really got an insight on that episode of like, how buildings actually work, and how you know, what’s going on inside your home. Because, you know, you know, it’s a very British saying you guys don’t know, but you know, a man’s home is his castle. And that’s a very like, British thing to say. But actually, you know, the very building that is supposed to protect your family might inadvertently by doing you quite a bit of harm if you don’t understand what’s going on within it. So
Stephanie Warner 17:48
Right, right. And Steve, I love this, quote so much our buildings, our third skin, you know, and that’s, that’s so true. We are an indoor, technically, we’re an indoor species at this point. And what we do with our homes is extremely important. It’s just as important as what we do with our skin.
R Blank 18:05
Yeah. And and further to your point, James, I think one of the things that Steven covered really well is, you know, you don’t have to fix everything, you don’t have to achieve perfection. This is a process. And in fact, there is no real perfection. Because everything comes with trade offs and a cost, you know, you’ll get a benefit. But there’s also a cost, but it’s a process and you do you know, you identify things, and then you do what you can about them. And then you you know, repeat as you as you have capacity to do but don’t stress about, you know, don’t be terrified that you’re not living in a perfect environment. I I at least felt that that Steven did a really good job communicating that part of it.
James Burtt 18:45
Yeah. And I think he’s he won’t, he said if if the place is filthy, it will cause you physical and emotional stress. And you’re totally awesome. So obviously you think about like, Oh, actually, physically, this can’t be good. But the emotional stress of that kind of stuff is kind of just that that niggle that just like chips away at you sort of thing, which I thought was was was a great insight. But like I say it’s Yeah, I’ve never I’ve been, as you mentioned at the beginning, I’d never even heard the term building biology. But now I actually really sort of consider how, how we we need to exist in these boxes effectively that we’ve decided that we’re all gonna live in.
R Blank 19:22
Yeah, no, totally. Yeah, absolutely. It was a great. Yeah, it was a great interview. And then we went from that to another building biologist, Cathy cook who, who was talking with us about building resilience with nutrition. And you know, James, Stephanie and I both know Cathy pretty well. We’ve been working with her for a while now. But this I’m pretty sure was your first exposure to Kathy and her message. How did it strike you?
James Burtt 19:51
Yeah, it definitely was the first engagement I’ve had of again, in preparation for for doing this podcast. I’ve done a bit of googling of Have a few people that are going to be involved just to try and have like some sort of semblance of being able to hold a conversation with people. But it was really, really interesting. And I love the fact that she’s, you know, we’re so willing to address those controversial subjects of electromagnetic hypersensitivity, and really break down what the symptoms were, and how to how to coat how to cope with it, and also, how to help somebody who does suffer with it, if that makes sense. Because that was a big point that I took from it was it wasn’t just like, this is what it is, this is why it’s bad. It was like, here’s how you can actually help someone. So there was a there’s almost like a tactical and practical element to it, which I thought was great.
R Blank 20:40
Yeah. 70 I know you and I’ve talked about this, just the, the part of the episode where Kathy and I were talking about what it’s what it’s like, just trying to understand what it’s like to live life this way. I know that that hit home pretty strongly for you.
Stephanie Warner 20:58
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. it you know, trying to be you know, a more empathetic human it listening to her story and how much it you know, this this sensitivity affected her was was was eye opening, and it really built my compassion muscle for people that you know, are and I we deal with, with people who are coming to us out of desperation all the time. And they’re experiencing serious health effects. And they’re, you know, some of them are in pain constantly. And like I said, it really listening to her really, really helped work that that compassion muscle and, you know, try to understand where how hard this in challenging it must be for somebody who is, you know, who’s dealing with this. And we’re in a world where there’s just so much EMF, what do you do that desperation?
James Burtt 21:57
Yeah, cuz there’s a stigma isn’t and that was, again, one of the, you know, you wouldn’t, if you saw somebody walking down the road with a broken leg, you wouldn’t go, Hey, you got a broken leg, as you can probably see it, it almost makes it more real. But you know, the, the, the suffering of someone who has issues with EHS are no less significant than somebody with a broken leg, you just can’t see it. And, you know, I think the message I took away from the episode was that we need to spread awareness regarding it as a health problem, because there is that stigma attached to it. So you’ve almost got people who are suffering, twice, almost, they’ve actually got the issue that they’re suffering through the IHS. And then you’ve also got the kind of the suffering that they’re getting from the ignorance of other people who are like, Oh, we’ve got a bit of a headache or whatever, you know, whatever the take on it is, and I think that’s definitely these days, I’m not sure what he’s like where you guys are, because and obviously, you’re spread globally, because because you’re international jetsetters. But in the United Kingdom, the mental health aspect of our mental of our overall health and well being is taking being taken a lot more seriously. So fingers crossed, as that becomes more mainstream, because you know, five years ago, you want to talk about your mental health in the workplace. But now, that’s a very, very everyday occurrence. So hopefully, EHS will be by talking about it. And by raising awareness, we’ll get to that level of clarity with it. And we have those kind of open conversations around it the same way that we are about mental health these days, because I think it’s like to say it’s no less detrimental to your health than breaking a bone just because you can’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there.
Stephanie Warner 23:25
Right? Absolutely. And I think it’s really important to just, you know, remember to believe people, you maybe you don’t understand the EMF, maybe you don’t understand what you’re or you maybe you doubt, you know, what’s affecting or causing the discomfort, but we just have to believe people because the fact is the person experiencing it, it is real to them. It is 100% so
R Blank 23:47
yeah, that’s what I was gonna say about James’s example about the broken leg and someone’s walking down the street with a broken leg and you say hi, you have a broken leg. It’s actually worse than that. It’s high. You think you have a broken leg? Wake up? Yes. And going through life experiencing that kind of pain where not only is there no relief, but people don’t even believe you. Is that that is the that is that is a it’s a tragedy and yeah, yeah. To live that way.
Stephanie Warner 24:16
You know it Kathy did share some experiences she’s had going into homes were one where that where the client is experiencing this this this discomfort and their spouse doesn’t believe that Yeah, and that’s like the most heartbreaking thing that you know, I that really touched me is you know, how difficult that must be to live in an environment where you’re in pain and then the person that you’re with you should be supporting you is gaslighting you and just doesn’t believe what’s happening.
R Blank 24:47
James Burtt 24:48
you must have a lot you get like you’re getting mad and you know, especially with this, yeah, you live in with a new love and you need that their support more than anything sort of again goes back to like the mental health thing over here in the UK. You know Let’s talk about depression and mental well being, you know, just wasn’t the conversation a couple of years ago, but it’s becoming much more mainstream. And again, I have to say, actually, on this point, because I’m using this you might be, hopefully it’s my Golden Caramel sounding voice. We’ve got a fancy studio that we use. And I’ve been getting headaches a lot when I’ve been in the studio, and I’ve been in this week into my 47th hour sat in the studio this week, around the top of maybe I’m just a bit sleep deprived. For me, that’s a subject for another podcast, probably, but I’m sad. You know, I’ve got three, I’m looking around the studio, and I’ve got three gigantic saw professional lighting rig, lights set up. I’ve got two monitors in front of me, I’ve got three computers around me, I’ve got a mixing desk, I’ve got four now 1234, black, 4k, black camp Blackmagic cameras, and every day I’ve been leaving with like, I feel really drained. And I’m actually is there more to this Do I need, you know, because it also is everything soundproof? And nothing can escape from this room. So I’m wondering, am I in this swirl of sort of emf and EHS sort of frequencies that I’m sort of just sat in the midst of so?
R Blank 26:07
Yeah, I mean, I think that’s a that’s a that’s a great segue to the next interview that we did with Lloyd Berle, which was also focused on electro sensitivity. And, you know, one thing that I think I brought up in in in that interview was my belief that more people have sensitivity to EMF than realize they haven’t, because they’re, they’re going to experience symptoms, and they’re going to chalk it up to something else, like, I just need more sleep, I’m working too hard. I just need an energy drink, or I should eat more salad and not realizing that it’s sitting around all of this tech and being exposed to these forces that is contributing to what they are sensing.
Stephanie Warner 26:50
Yeah. And, and in that interview, too, which is interesting is that all of those things you just said can also be true. Yeah. So like, you know, Lloyd Lloyd described his journey as a long journey that took a holistic approach. Because, yeah, tired is also a thing not, you know, being overworked and stressed, those are all contributing factors as well. And emf is another sensitivity is another thing that’s part of this health spectrum.
James Burtt 27:19
The other thing with with Lloyd was he was talking about this stuff, he said, obviously though, I live in the real world, you know, I’ve got a blog, and you know, in a mailing list of a couple of 100,000 people who need to hear from every single week, so I haven’t, you know, just gone and lived out in the countryside in the middle of nowhere in a year. Like I have to be using my devices, I just use them intentionally and as safely as possible things like simple stuff like the I think he mentioned using an ethernet cable, rather than using Wi Fi. Using I think he might have mentioned a landline phone, or using, you know, having a really basic mobile phone. So you haven’t got all of the other sort of techie bits included within it. So I think that’s the kind of stuff and this is what hopefully the the main point of this pot or one of the powers of this podcast season especially for because I know you obviously you guys are like in the thick of it because this is your your main thing day in day out. But just for me, it definitely makes me think about what actually is EMF and how is it emitted? Because Yeah, we’ve all heard like, Don’t put your don’t put your phone in your pocket. No one really knows why. But we just sort of heard that conventional wisdom is like Okay, sure. But you’re thinking, blah, stand, you know, Bob sit with my laptop on my lap all afternoon. That’s absolutely fine. Obviously, it’s not, you know, I’ll be I remember my dad actually, he when he when he was still alive. And my mum was convinced of this, by the way. And we all thought that she was crackers at the time. But maybe she maybe ironically, she wasn’t my dad had a bit the server for his company was in his office. And whenever you’d walk in there was always roasting hot, it was always boiling. And they had this server for like 3040 accountants or whatever it was. So actually knowing what I know now, after this conversation, I wonder how much damage that actually was doing to him because, as I say, when used to walk into his office, regardless whether it’s summer or winter, there’s always this weird horrible heat in there. And he’s, you know, he’s literally sat next to a, like a transmitter of emf for, you know, nine hours a diary for 15 years, which I can’t imagine did any good. Frankly,
R Blank 29:15
a lot of people have these exposures that they do until they know to think about it, they don’t think about it. And yeah,
Stephanie Warner 29:21
absolutely. My my graph pictures of my grandfather up on the telephone poles, he was a he was part of the effort to you know, fix and streamline electric poles in Vermont, in the you know, in the 40 to get in the 50s. And I wonder, you know how that must have affected his his health and his his early passing.
R Blank 29:45
Um, dad and I were writing overpowered I don’t remember if this made it into the book, but my mother brought up this example. You know, because you know, my parents, they were born in the in the 30s. And I gather You know, when they were growing up, they had Little novelty X ray machines at like the Five and Dime where they they encourage you to you know, isn’t it cool you can look at the the, the the bones in your foot. So put your foot in the X ray machine, so you can hit your foot. And it sounds unbelievable now, but that’s what they used to do. And it’s sort of like, I feel like in the future, we’re gonna look back on this era and say, I can’t believe the way we were using technology. Yeah, yeah. And
James Burtt 30:29
it starts with this, though, doesn’t it? It starts with a podcast like this. And it starts with conversations like this, it starts with guests like Lloyd, who can break it down and get rid of the woowoo in the conspiracy theories and go now actually, here’s the science behind it, you know, every single thing that creates electricity does create an EMF, if you want to believe it or not, this is not about 5g towers, and all this kind of stuff, you know that because that’s, that’s unfortunately, again, and maybe this is the wrong take on it. But from the layperson, or the persons outside this conversation, there’s sort of the EMF world is sort of, is really kind of vilified by those who are, you know, they’re to grab attention for their own gain, frankly, you know, the fear mongering conspiracy theories. And I think, unfortunately, that’s where, you know, the likes of the rest of the industry are actually just talking great practical sense, you know, Lloyd’s book, you know, EMF practical guides, you know, it’s not there to scare monger is like, here’s some facts based on science, read it or don’t, but these are, this is literally what’s happening. electromagnetic fields are real, they’re coming from your cell phone and your devices and everything else that’s got electricity is giving off an EMF, whether you like to believe it or not, it’s just science. But I think it starts with these conversations had by, you know, like, you guys are doing this podcast and just sensible people who can put a rational, rational point across in a way that’s specifically designed not just to scare everybody into, you know, running to the hills.
R Blank 31:52
Yeah, and one thing that this podcast and many other people who are involved in this industry, one thing we have to overcome is, is, is this tech addiction, which has come up multiple times in the season, and which wireless industry lobbyists and skeptics, they they kind of abused that they take advantage of people, people, people who are addicted to this stuff, don’t even want to hear that it’s dangerous. And I think in that next episode, we’re where we had Gary breka. And he talked about much more than tech addiction. But in particular, you know, his approach to helping to break tech addiction was was really mind opening for me.
James Burtt 32:33
Yeah, Gary is someone that I’ve known for a few years now. And he’s a really, really insightful guy. And he’s, he’s got this beautiful ability, unless you let him go down the rabbit hole, in which case, he’s gonna drag you along for the ride. But one of the things I most love about him is that he’s got the ability when he chooses to do so to take really complex concepts and make them simple. So I remember he was sort of talking to me about methylation pathways and how the blood actually utilizes oxygen and the power of oxygenation and all that kind of stuff. And I actually flew to Miami a few years ago to interview him for a podcast. And he sat down in the lobby of his Fantasticks, or clinic. And he was explaining this stuff to me as Oh, this is brilliant cuz I can actually understand it. But again, one of the things that came out for me was, you know, the, just do the basics. There’s so many like simple, basic things that we can do for the betterment of our health in general. But I think Gary sort of highlighted it beautifully. Things that you know, you mentioned, I think, in the intro, to that episodes, definitely about the Wim Hof breathing, you know, that, as simple as that, you know, breathing in and breathing out for 30 or 32 rounds of that sounds overly simple, but sort of the the eastern world in the sort of the world have been more in sort of meditation and a bit more of a spiritual understanding of us as beings rather than, you know, us in the Western world, traditionally, I think those basics is what we need to go back to. And it’s great that people like Gary and Wim Hof are kind of popularizing that kind of stuff. Because in a world where we’re using more devices for more amount of time, we’re plugged in literally, we’re plugged into more stuff for so much of our of our waking hours, you know, even just taking the time to get outside and do the breath work. We’d said about you know, the, the saunas, and then the cold ice bath therapies and all that kind of stuff. Fingers crossed. You know, in a world where exactly as you mentioned, we don’t actually want we’re willing addicts, we don’t want to hear that our phones killing us. We don’t want to hear that Netflix is bad. We don’t want to hear that sitting on a computer for 10 hours a day isn’t good for us because it doesn’t serve you know how we’ve designed our lives in the majority of cases fingers crossed that even if we are doing all that bad stuff, we can be you know, a bit more mindful with a podcast like this and then maybe take some of those basic tactical steps from Gary and you know, it doesn’t have to be rocket science or complicated we can do the basic stuff to help ourselves Fingers crossed.
Stephanie Warner 34:52
Yeah, and you know what you’re saying it’s it’s like a mindful so we you know, obviously being more mindful about our artistic But like the basics, what is more basic than breathing? You What is more basic than that. So taking the time, and allowing ourselves to take the time to make that important and to focus on it, because in a world of tech, our attention is pulled in 100 different directions. And you know, if we can just step back a little bit, and do just just focus on breathing, what you know, what a big impact that can have on our health, because it just doesn’t get any more basic than that.
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R Blank 35:34
Yeah. And I think that’s also really valuable for for people who are interested in in EMF and health and living healthier by reducing their exposure to EMF, you know, we talk all the time about the ways that you can reduce your exposure, but Gary was just, you know, another person in this season, who illuminated another approach, right? Because yes, reducing your exposure as part of it, but also addressing other areas of your physiology and your health can also improve your resilience and make this make it’s like a balance. It’s like a seesaw. Right? You want to you want to reduce your exposure, but you also want to improve your health. And Gary, I thought was, was really fantastic at illuminating that sort of that other side of the equation.
James Burtt 36:20
Yeah. And Kathy touched on that really well as in her episodes as well, didn’t she, you know, there’s sort of the basics of getting the nutrition right, and trying to make sure you’re in taking as much of the good stuff as you can. You know, I’m grateful that you know, in the United Kingdom, we haven’t got everything right. But definitely the the food supply seems to be a little bit better than I know, a lot of what I imagined a lot of the listeners for this podcast will come from the United States in the food, there seems to be a real bone of contention. So like, you know, if you took took away the two lessons from this, you know, eats more of this stuff suggested by Kathy and then do some breathing as suggested by Gary, then you’re on your way to being a little bit healthier, if nothing else. And I’ve actually I’ve got to say that I’ve implemented the Wim Hof breathing on a day to day basis off the back of that podcast, and it’s having a real impact. Really,
R Blank 37:06
I hope you’re not doing that deep breathing when you’re standing over your carpet James, my head out the window, I’ve got no devices. Well, so and this brings us to the final interview we had this season. And you know, after listening to everything that we were just talking about, and everything that came up in the interviews, this season, you might be wondering, and it’s a totally reasonable question to ask, how is this stuff even legal? That’s what we had Dr. David Davis on to help address this. What did you think of that interview, James,
James Burtt 37:37
I was absolutely staggeringly stunned at the idiocy with which decisions are made. And I know that the world is, you know, largely run by economics. I’m not naive to that fact. But the pure and simple. You know, the fact that she shared that the radiation, I think it was Dr. Devereaux, who said that the radiation test that they utilize for mobile phones was done 25 years ago. And the radiation, sort of legitimacy stats were based on a six foot man weighing in at about 200 pounds, using the device for five seconds, or 20 seconds or something like that, you know, no, kids of nine and eight years old, who are, you know, one quarter of that weight, and actually they’re using it for six hours a day is absolutely staggering. And the fact that she mentioned about, you know, the French, the French companies who are now who are the only people who are actually studying this in the right way. And the fact that certain districts in France are banning terminals and 5g towers and stuff within a certain circumference of schools is staggering in this day and age, that the stuff that she was talking about actually still happens. I couldn’t lie. If I hadn’t been in on that conversation listening to it, I wouldn’t have believed it, you know, talking the reduction in sperm count, outsider’s memory loss cancers. I mean, it’s the sort of stuff that you it’s very Erin Brockovich, isn’t it? You know, it’s very much like Hollywood nightmare film, but actually, it’s the reality is, which is, it’s crazy to me is crazy.
Stephanie Warner 39:11
Yeah. And, you know, what also is kind of eye opening for me, is, you know, because I’m familiar with the lack of regulation. But what’s stunning is, you know, I realized in myself the assumptions I’ve made throughout my life, that that because something is regulated, quote, unquote, that it is safe. And it’s, you know, this really illuminated that that is not true. If something’s regulated, learn how it’s regulated, learn what that actually means be a little more curious and a little less trusting that our best interest is being protected. Yeah,
R Blank 39:51
no, just that that biases. Everyone has that bias that if I can buy it in a store, it’s safe and that is trust. That is no We’re near true, it is nowhere near true. And I think Dr. Davis did a really good job of helping to explain, you know, how that applies to wireless technology, in particular, and just and why it’s so important this litigation that she’s engaged with, against the the FCC in the United States, why that is so important.
James Burtt 40:20
Yeah, absolutely. Because, like she shared, you know, cell phones have never been tested for safety for long term effects. You know, we’re maybe not that abundantly aware of it now, and we don’t, you know, we’ve got this kind of, yeah, we think we’re live forever, but you know, give it give it 20 or 30 years, when these things have been in circulation for a good couple of decades. And then I think we have a real real, you know, epidemic of fear on our hands about what we’ve been walking around. Because effectively, we’re walking around the very device that enables us to live our life more easily, ultimately, might end up with us living our lives much more shortly based on it. And but what I loved about Dr. Davis was, you know, get the devices off your body and those of your children distances your friend, I think she said, Look closer. So again, she was, she was not here to strike fear into the heart of the listener, but equally, a cheer, I just hope that people take a little bit of information from it, and go and utilize it, because we’ve got to stop being willing victims, because otherwise what’s gonna happen, you know, it’s gonna be a case that in 20 years time, the knock is the apples, the hallways and all that sort of stuff are going to be, I don’t know why Huawei is a good front and center. But really, we had an inkling this was happening for 20 or 30 years, don’t get upset about it now that everyone’s dying off early as a species, I think we, you know, we’ve we’re very much a risk of being the first of our first generation to actually live a shorter life than our parents. And I think a lot of that is our own doing, we are very, very willing victims in this instance, because the information is out there, if we decide to look for it.
Stephanie Warner 41:53
Yeah. And, you know, I want to log on to that, that willing victim concept is one thing that that was a through line throughout this season, is the effect on children who are not willing participants there, you know, so Dr. Davis was talking about, you know, the, the, the the reality and the truth that, that children have thinner skulls, and she’s talking about in, you know, fertility challenges. So there’s, there’s a tangible result to, you know, exposing children and exposing pregnant women and in and fertile men to EMF and I think it’s, it’s important to recognize, too, that, you know, children aren’t willing, we’re teaching them we’re guiding them as to how to use how to use their tech. And it’s important, I think she pointed out to make sure that kids don’t have, you know, cell phones, until they’re, you know, until they’re, they’re developed, ya
R Blank 42:56
know, just having some sanity.
James Burtt 42:59
Yeah. And I remember when she said that at the time, and it’s really interesting to have the same effect on me now, when she said children have got thinner skulls, it made me run cold. It made me literally put children my spine, as you just said it, then stuff it makes for really uncomfortable, because I’ve got, I’ve got a four year old and I’ve got a 10 month old. And I’ve definitely, you know, if the aim of the game of the podcast was to change consumer behavior with the content then is definitely worked on, at least to me, because, you know, with my son’s playing with his little iPad thing, now, we put it on, not hands free on airplane mode. So there’s not getting it’s not downloading everything. You know, I keep I keep the phone away from them. Because you do you sort of forget, it’s really interesting to talk about the fertility thing and not to get too personal about it. But my my wife and I was trying for a baby the first time and it took us about three years. And it’s really interesting at that time, I was, you know, dopey phone in your pocket, you know, is where’s your phone, your phone in your pocket, it’s in your pocket. And as soon as we had kids, as soon as she got what she wanted from me. Obviously, the phone goes back in the pocket a lot more. series, and now I’m very, very mindful of it. I’m very mindful of it now. You know, I’m
Stephanie Warner 44:06
really intrigued that she knew that that she was like, Hey, don’t put that in your pocket? Did she did was she aware of the science? Or was it just something that maybe she had heard in passing and was like, desperate for children that you are not
R Blank 44:19
giving her? A lot of people know, I think a lot of people sort of maybe subconsciously know that this stuff isn’t good. You know, because I see it. My so you know, when I meet people, they ask what I do, and I tell them and like yeah, I’ve always sort of thought you know, I after a call my ears kind of warm and it’s I always thought that that wasn’t quite right. And, you know, I so people don’t want to hear this stuff. But at the same time, they already sort of
James Burtt 44:49
said, therein lies the problem you’ve hit the nail on the head are perfectly. I always sort of knew where you beat and do nothing about it. You always saw you know, when you take out your phone after a day and you’ve and your legs tingles a little bit. I don’t know if anyone’s had that experience. I’m like, oh god, oh yeah. Oh god, that’s the EMF. You know like to say my wife she read, she read blogs about fertility and stuff and straight away, they’re like, you know, no hot Barb’s no saunas, no tight pants, get your phone out your pocket, all that basic stuff to improve fertility. But again, not how much more is it in my pocket now that I’m not as mindful of it. And I think that that’s the that’s the challenge isn’t it is to is to get people to just be that little bit more, more mindful about it. Because that whole excuse of I kind of thought, I kind of thought I wasn’t quite right or ignorance isn’t bliss is just means you’re ignorant to it. And, again, there’s no, you know, back in it, you know, 40 5060 years ago, you’d have to go and you know, very, very work very hard to find out this information, you know, I would have taken a man like your dad, to write a book about this stuff, to bring it to our conscious awareness, we, you know, we do not deserve to be ignorant to this now, because the information is there, if we choose to look at it, but we have got to choose to look at it.
Stephanie Warner 45:54
Yeah. And I think I think that’s where that’s one key and importance to this podcast, and the way that we structured it so that, you know, you’re getting the information, but you’re also getting, you know, easy to do action tips that you can do today. So taking out that daunting ness, it’s like, you literally just have to be a little bit mindful and make a small change, you know, and that’s going to help improve your health. And focusing on those little steps is I think how we get to a place where they just become part where these, these actions just become part of what we do.
R Blank 46:29
So I’m gonna ask both of you, and I know you neither of you are totally on bias here, obviously. But when when we started the season, I said, welcome to the healthier tech podcast, the podcast about ways of building and maintaining a healthier relationship with technology. Do you guys think that we accomplish that goal this season? Yeah.
James Burtt 46:48
Only if people go and take take some form of action, you know, they used to say knowledge is power is not, you know, applied knowledge is power. So it’s all willing to listen to ironically, you’re probably listening to this conversation on the very device that we are telling you to stay away from, or one of the devices, Chuck, you know, you might even be, and I haven’t got any of these anymore. thanks to Dr. Deborah, maybe you were listening to this on air pods prior to listening to that episode, maybe you’ve changed your behavior. But again, it’s still I have to say, you know, in my ignorance, I’ve, you know, there’s been days I can’t find my wired headphones on, I just grabbed the Bluetooth ones, I think I’ll be right, just, you know, I’ll just be quick, I just have a quick dose of, you know, head cancer in my ear lobes potentially. So again, for me, the knowledge isn’t enough, it’s the application of the knowledge that is the difference that will make the difference. But I definitely think we’ve gone we’ve gotten some way to, to definitely in a real actionable and tangible way show people some basic steps, cuz that’s one of the things I’ve got to say and credit to you guys, because you had a real vision for this at the beginning. And maybe I didn’t get fully not on board of it. But I didn’t know how important it was going to be. Given that we do not want to scare monger people want to give it be real simple, really tactical, we don’t want to make anybody wrong. We just want to make people just just a little bit more aware. And I think that all of the guests that you born, you know, the the guest list has been beautifully curated. Because no one came on and said, Hey, you got to go and lobby the government or go to your council or change yourself up to a to a cell phone tower is like, no, turn your turn your wife off at night. Be mindful about your carpet, open the windows when you hoovering like it’s real basic stuff. But it could actually have a real impact on implementing, you know, a positive impact on your life. So I’ve got to say full credit to you guys, because I think it’s been a fantastic deployment of what you guys wanted to do, which was to make a difference without scaremongering. I think it’s exactly what you set out to do. I think it’s a job well done, I would say.
Stephanie Warner 48:43
Well, thank you, thank you. And I and I just want to chime in also, that like I am in this world of emf I’m every single day. And I was illuminated on several in several these, you know, every interview really, but there were some tactical things that I was able to apply. And the nutrition side really was is just not something that I realized how easy it is to add more tumeric cumin, and to like build up my resilience to EMF because I hadn’t really thought about it in that way. And you know, so so even I found things throughout this entire season that I’m able to take action on. And regarding EMF and also you know, other aspects of health. And you know, Gary and Steve really helped, you know, show some other things that I can do to help my overall health.
James Burtt 49:41
What about you? Did you did you pick up some learnings unless I assumed Yeah, obviously I had I had tons to learn you guys had tweaks to make.
R Blank 49:49
Yeah, well, I mean, I feel like I learned I learned quite a bit. Obviously I was already familiar with a lot of the subject matter that we covered but even Even with the people that I, you know, was very familiar with, like Dr. Deborah Davis, some, I think I commented during the episode itself or in the closing of the episode, you know, life is not an emergency. And I it sounds, it sounds almost silly to say that that stood out to me. But it was so you know, after the past year, it was just it was it was so centering to hear that but and that’s from someone that I already know very well, and I’m familiar with her work. But you know, listening to people like Gary breka and Adam Cox, you know that those both gave very different, but perspectives on tech addiction and ones that I was not already familiar with. And I, you know, I feel like I learned a lot. And, you know, at this point, I’d also like to ask the listeners, you know, what did you feel like you learned a lot this season? Did you like the people that we interviewed? Do you think that there are other subjects that we should pick for season two or other people we should interview for season two, if you have that feedback, we really want to hear from you. And so we’re gonna ask you to please leave it in the reviews on the podcast, we’re on whatever platform you’re listening on, because that is going to help us sculpt an even better second season for you of the healthier tech podcast.
Stephanie Warner 51:18
Absolutely. What What questions do you have you know, based on what what you’ve heard, we covered a lot but of course you know, as you’re hearing it and you’re applying it to your own life, it’s going to there’s there’s potentially questions and and of course your comments we’ll we’ll be reading them and logging them and helping using that to help us define what season two will be and and we really hope that you do join us for season two and we we hope that you feel empowered at leaving leaving this you know, as we close out season one
R Blank 51:52
and yeah, before signing up, James, I really want to thank you for not just for today, although your participation today was was really fantastic. But for the whole season for guiding us through this, this new endeavor, this new experience of podcasting where you’re a Maestro, it was it was really invaluable to have you spearhead and be a part of this project.
James Burtt 52:15
thank thank you very much. And honestly, there are certain podcasts that I do that I get involved in so I’ve done a lot now like 150 odd probably by the time this one goes live in terms of like launches for for various projects. And there’s only certain ones where you like oh my god, I can’t believe how much I’ve got to learn. I have to admit there was several episodes where I felt guilty that you were the client and I was the person charging the money to do the service. Free mentoring from these people I feel a little bit guilty. But I’ve honestly I’ve I’ve taken a lot of notes from it. I’ve I’ve done I’ve definitely actually changed my consumer behaviors. The phone is out the phone is out of the bedroom, the laptop is off of the lap, and the carpet is going to get burned as soon as the landlord
Stephanie Warner 53:00
let that you should you should share the interview with Steve Colette with your with your landlord.
James Burtt 53:07
I’ll say it wasn’t my fault. Steve Collette told me to do it. I had
Stephanie Warner 53:13
humanity. Well, thank you, James. You know, this has been a really great experience. And I’m really happy with that we had your participation throughout the whole thing and in this episode, and so
R Blank 53:27
yeah, and to everyone else out there in podcast land. Remember that you can learn more sign up to our mailing list and get notified when we have a season two at shield your body.com that shield your body all one word calm and you can also just click that link in the show notes. Until next season R Blank and I want to thank you so much for tuning into Season One of the healthier tech podcast and always remember to shield your body. If you liked this show and want to hear more, please remember to subscribe to this podcast to healthier tech podcast available on all major podcasting platforms. And if you have a moment please also leave a review reviews are critical to help more people find this podcast and learn about the important and undercover topics that we cover. And you can also learn more and sign up for our mailing list to get notified when we have new interviews, webinars, ebooks and sales at shield your body calm that shield your body all one word calm. You can also just click that link in the show notes. Until next time, I’m R Blank and I want to thank you so much for tuning into the healthier tech podcast and always remember to shield your body